And a lot of pain, I guess, made me fight. They could shut me out from sequel rights. Wow. And, like I said, it got me my first agent, a guy named Harold Moskowitz[starts laughing] who, a little while later, was looking for help with another one of his clients. I don't know if they ever approached Chuck Norris, but Chuck didn't seem right. After directing Jean-Claude in Double Impact [1991] and Lionheart [1990] before that, was there any reason you didn't want to be involved with writing or directing?Sheldon Lettich: That was right after another movie I did called Only the Strong [1993] and I seemed to have a lot of other things going on. I met Gladys, the woman of my dreams, I had a baby, and I'm miserable. So there would be one shot where you would see both brothers in the same shot, kind of talking to one another and then all the other shots were either close-ups or over-the-shoulders done with a double. And one of those people was Sylvester Stallone, who had put the word out that he was looking for someone to help him write Rambo III. Did that piece directly lead to Bloodsport? She said, "Wait a minute, I'll be right back" and then comes in with the same magazine. California, Oregon and Washington. An animatronic dinosaur with a teen's brain, dinosaur charades, a weird striptease for a brain in a bowl, and much more. I should also back up and say that I was really poor growing up. And basically what happens is I told the story to Sheldon. And then he did a kick that missed his face by like two inches. And I walked out on the ledge and I was waiting for him because I knew he wasn't going to come alone. Please note as always our subject'sopinions, recollections and claims are his own, and do not reflect the views of the author or this publication. And he was an idol of Jean-Claude's too.Blake Harris: Yeah? I literally wrote a good majority of that script with Sheldon, but I never got credit for it. That kind of caught my fancy. And he did that to Sheldon several times. In a recent documentary, Admiral Horton Smith not only acknowledges that I was a covert operative, but also states that any record of mine would have to come out of the Federal Intelligence Court. Because he's riding on the coattails of Jean-Claude. And he was brought to our attention through Sheldon. Blake Harris: Since martial arts is, and has been, such a large part of your life, I was wondering if it was also a large part of your childhood.Frank Dux: Actually, no. That's kind of how it appealed to me. Does that even look the same? And I said, "If you're gonna go, just don't pull me with you." That's how Frank and I met.Blake Harris: Do you remember what your first meeting was like?Sheldon Lettich: We hit it off right away. Find ratings and reviews for the newest movie and TV shows. They wanted to stick with the Van Damme formula. And I remember Mark telling us, "Menahem is thinking of casting this guy Gene Claude Van Damme. I don't know if the word "genius" is maybe taking it too high, but this is a very smart creative guy who is very much underappreciated. I think that's why people really love it. The whole martial arts thing. joins Paul, June, and Jason to break down the 1994 Sly Stallone & Sharon Stone thriller The Specialist, a movie that argues bombs are more precise weapons than guns. I made a joke and it just took him out of it, snapped him out of it.Blake Harris: Laughter is the best medicine, right?Frank Dux: I took him out of it. There had been a few other plays dealing with the military and Vietnam at the time, but they weren't written by those who had actually been there. And we did. "We have no recollection of such a tournament," said Kenneth Wilson, a spokesman for the Ministry of Sports in the Bahamas. Enter the Ninja?Sheldon Lettich: No, there was no script prior to the "Bloodsport" script. But I'm curious, getting back to what you were saying earlierand what to ultimately led to that story you describedat what point was the producer Mark DiSalle convinced that Jean-Claude would work? I wasn't an actor, but I was a writer, so I got in touch with John and we hit it off. And he said yeah. KUMITE! And the two of them, they didn't talk about it, but they'd basically bicker through their agents because neither one wanted to be the criminal who gets killed at the end. So he pitched me the story for Kickboxer and I said, "Well, if you're looking for a martial arts film, I've got one of my own that I think you might likeBloodsport." They'll cover Frank Dux being a real man, Van Damme's soft baby b. "Below are some of the key points and accusations made in the piece: Frank Dux: By the way, the L.A. Times won't even defend the article anymore. You said "we were working on a sequel." That's bullshit, that's total bullshit.Blake Harris: What about those claims regarding your covert military background? Either way, it's fair to say that filmgoers are a pretty forgiving lot. And I was writing for Stallone at the time and I actually asked Jean-Claude for some help with some of the dialogue for a script I was working on.Blake Harris: I imagine that this was during that timeabout two years or sowhen Bloodsport just kind of sat there on the shelves. And separates Mike's shoulder. I'm not kidding you. And the story there, which I've told many times, came from Frank telling me about his exploits. For the first time in about 14 years. In downtown L.A. And I go: Well, just do me a favor. All of this was prior to Bloodsport. That's not even my name. Jeez. That's just point of the absurdity of the whole thing.Blake Harris: And, when you were there, how did the reporter respond to all this?Frank Dux: I embarrassed the hell out of him. Bloodsport is the name of several supervillains appearing in American comic books published by DC Comics.All of these versions exist in DC's main shared universe, known as the DC Universe.. And he turns to me and he says: "You know, Frankie, I signed a five-picture deal. Do you still believe I that?" On May 1, 1988, just over two months after Bloodsport hit theaters, John Johnson of the L.A. Times published this editorial:NINJA: Hero or Master Fake?Others Kick Holes in Fabled Past of Woodland Hills Martial Arts TeacherAs the title suggests, the piece isn't too kind to Dux. Synopsis:U.S. Army Captain Frank Dux (Jean-Claude Van Damme), who had been trained as a boy by the legendary Ninjutsu master Senzo Tanaka, decides to honor his mentor by taking the place of Tanaka's dead son in an illegal, no-holds-barred martial arts tournament called the "Kumite. I never accused the military of doing it. And so we climbed back over the wall and onto the set. How blindsided were you when the piece came out?Frank Dux: Well, there was nothing I could do. The Origins of Gladiatorial Games. I mean, he couldn't do a throw. And then all the Black Dragons got around methey were like the Hells Angels of the martial arts world at that timeand I didn't know what they were going to do. In 1993, Dux got beaten up by a guy in the first tournament, a guy by the name of "Nasty" Zane Frazier, who is known for knocking himself out when he and his opponent rolled out of the ring and hit the floor. And just a few more questions. How Did This Get Made is a companion to the podcastHow Did This Get MadewithPaul Scheer, Jason MantzoukasandJuneDiane Raphaelwhich focuses on movies. And so he told Menahem, "Sell it to me and I'll release it theatrically." He would punch the bricks, breaking them apart. A lot of those shots came from the camera angles I had been directing. He was born with all sorts of birth defectshe had one leg shorter than the other, he didn't have a jawboneand because of my own, I don't know, "disability," we became friends. Because you didn't do it in Hong Kong." He went in and redid it. It was offered to him and Seagal. That this guy looks just like me and we should suggest it to Mark DiSalle. I showed him some video footage, and that's how the project started.Blake Harris: Before talking about next steps, I'm curious to hear more about your initial script. I remember there was a stack of scripts lining the walltitles written on the spineand I notice one script in particular. Menahem says, "Oh, Corsican Brothers, that's perfect for Jean-Claude! Then all of the sudden I got hit in the face with a Black Dragon shirt, and that's how I became the youngest Black Dragon in the history of the Black Dragons.Blake Harris: That's unbelievable. Menahem started to realize what he had with Jean-Claudeand remember, he had two more movies with himso he called us into his office and said, "We need to find our next movie for Jean-Claude." And apparently it did huge business. Especially when you believe that person is your friend.Frank Dux: Exactly. You had mentioned that you and Sheldon reshaped that original script. It was called Firebase and was basically Zulu in Vietnam; about a small disparate group forced together on a Firebase that gets attacked by an overwhelming number of North Vietnamese. Okay, try him out. I was afraid to taste it, because I'm allergic to shellfish. Sheldon Lettich: We got some amazing reviews and it just turned into a little bit of a mini-phenomenon. And I was right: He came with [Bloodsport actor] Michel Qissi and two other guys. Rambo was always a reluctant badass.Sheldon Lettich: Yeah, you've really gotta push him to fight. Apparently, Stallone had read the same article and he was thinking exactly the same thing. Double Impact was financed, mostly, through pre-sales and, as it was structured, each of those companies also own a piece of the movie. Bloodsport. But to my pleasant surprise, Lettich was a complete gentleman. Everything you've just been telling me about this Kumite, that's a great idea for a movie. And so the ink was barely dry when I drove right over to Moshe's house and we signed a deal to do what became Double Impact.Blake Harris: From a technological standpoint, what were some of the biggest challenges with shooting two Jean-Claudes?Sheldon Lettich: The biggest challenges were that we were still using old technology. I mean, they put it on the shelf for two years. We expect embellishment, we condone narrative condensation and we celebrate character-driven points of view. By Earwolf, Paul Scheer, June Diane Raphael, and Jason Mantzoukas. You can listen to theBloodsportedition of the HDTGM podcasthere. Idc, even have a "Thor and Cap trade weapons moment" in Endgame with those two. In 1980, Frank Dux first came into the public eye via an article in the November issue of Black Belt magazine. If you want to look it up, the SEAL manual number is K-431-0097.Blake Harris: Great. So we had a number of people come to my apartment; John would test them out for their acting abilities and we would also try to determine if they were for real.Blake Harris: In what sense?Sheldon Lettich: Oh, I just meant we'd try to determine if they were really Vietnam veterans. And the receipt was dated 1982, okay? You see my point? It's a tale so amazing that two months after the film's release, it was dismissed by the L.A. Times as nothing but a fabricated "macho fantasy." But when I got done with him he was doing front flips, he was doing great.Blake Harris: And what about his personality? We encountered a few phonies, but eventually we put together a core group. "Blake Harris: [laughter]Sheldon Lettich: I tried to make my case. So my agent sent him Firebase and he responded very enthusiastically. And at the Invitationals, there's Bruce Lee. And then one day I get invited down to the Long Beach Invitationals. He was considered "unstoppable" at that time. I didn't see it coming. Except the version that Stallone had in mind was for a present day French Foreign Legion movie about two American buddies who enlist. He was a little too old at the time. And they did. In fact, we all went out to celebrate. You know, Jean-Claude was totally overwhelmed when he got to work with Stallone on Expendables 2. And that's one of the things that were attractive about Rambo so that's what we did with that script.Blake Harris: And what was it like working with Rambo himself?Sheldon Lettich: I was just so honored. I don't know if they ever approached Michael Dudikoff, but basically the producers were in a quandary as to who to cast. Though defeated, this wasn't the last the heroes of the DC Universe saw of Bloodsport. Kurt had played football at Prairie View College in the 60's. He remembered that there were different shots. ". This regular featureis written byBlake J. Harris, who you might know as the writer ofthe bookConsole Wars, soon to be a motion pictureproduced bySeth RogenandEvan Goldberg. Bloodsport is a 1988 American martial arts film directed by Newt Arnold, and starring Jean-Claude Van Damme, Donald Gibb, Leah Ayres, and Bolo Yeung. The Corsican Brothers. I gotta tell you: Seeing it years later, I didn't realize how good it was. And it's kind of funny because those are superfluous elements to the film. Sadly not at all. 20th Century Fox was high on Only the Strong and we all kind of expected that movie to do better than it did. And I'll never forgetand I'm terrified of heights, by the way. And I just want to end it right now." Shortly after running our last piece, How Did This Get Made: A Conversation with Frank Dux, the Real-Life Inspiration for Bloodsport, I was put in touch with Sheldon Lettich. Like, very famously, he turned down Demolition Man. And we actually got hired by Motown to write this script! I walked over there and he threw a playful kick at my head. I was there at every meeting and, of course, they were getting all the ideas out of me. Yet with Bloodsport, this was not the case. So he re-cut the fights, Michael restructured the movie and when we saw the next cut (which was quite a while later), the movie really worked. I remember us going back to his apartment and the thing was entirely full.Blake Harris: Did Menahem change his tune about Jean-Claude?Sheldon Lettich: Well, yes and no. He had an answering machine at the time that had a limit of, like, 50 messages. Blake Harris: So we know how Sheldon entered the picture, but how does Jean-Claude Van Damme become involved with Bloodsport?Frank Dux: Oh, Jean-Claude tells this crazy story. It's incredible." "But I will say this," Lettich continued. During that time, I gave Jean-Claude some odd jobs. And I'm talking a six-inch ledge. It was very time-consuming and it was not easy to match things up with the optical printer, but I thought we did a pretty good job of that. I still had not yet met Jean-Claude at this time. So I have all these memories of falling down stairs and crawling on my knees. Surprised? KUMITE! It was going to be a surprise appearance. It was awarded the Drama-Logue Critics' Award for Direction and the Los Angeles Drama Critics' Award for Ensemble Performance. Because my idea for Rambo III was: well, there's only one place Rambo could goAfghanistan. This was significant not only because he wrote the screenplay for Bloodsport, but also because Dux had said some unflattering things about the writer. Mr. Dux and I met in Tegucigalpal, Honduras, in the summer of 1985, where I was being briefed by Dux and other intelligence operatives on military targets within Nicaragua. But, Dux's version of the event is that Frazier . It was a moment where you have to sit back and realize that sometimes when you think something's wrong, everything is going right. As a result, he's spent the past 28 years dealing with perpetual allegations of being a fake and a fraud. One of these covert operatives was one Frank Dux. You know, there's a certain romanticism to that. A good example of that is Bloodsport. They'll cover Frank Dux being a real man, Van Damme's soft baby buns, blindfolded tea training, the not so secret illegal Kumite martial-arts tournament, Ray Jackson, and much more. But, I mean, he couldn't do a forward roll when I first got him. And Menahem was dead set against it.Blake Harris: Why?Sheldon Lettich: [Laughing at the memory] His word for Jean-Claude was "poison." I need to tell you about something that happened first. And he's in this movie called No Retreat, No Surrender. They were just being assholes.Blake Harris: That seemed to happen a lot at CannonSheldon Lettich: Now Blake, I have never filed a lawsuit against anyone in this business, but I filed a lawsuit against those guys, against Cannon. During the tournament, Dux battles an array of international fighters from various schools of martial arts. If it's Stallone: no problem, he can kill me on screen at the end.Blake Harris: The ultimate complimentSheldon Lettich: Ha, yes.Blake Harris: Speaking of Jean-Claude, I imagine that you first met him around this time. He was totally against any kind of steroids. Back when I first started working with Stallone, my agent had told me to bring an idea to pitch him for a script. And it was painful. 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